The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

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Macabee
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The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by Macabee »

Hello, my name is Macabee and I'm an Aztec lamer.

Last night I played a 3 v 3 team clan game and I was really a lamer. To start, we built our forward bases and I started making my op mace. Someone says attack - and we move to the enemies' home towns. One of the enemy had massed lots of long bows. Reluctantly, I try to retreat my op mace. A few of them make it back to the forward base. Then I lame my mighty op coyotes. I had a pretty good number of them until the Long bows, rods and others arrived. The forward bases were gone.

I built 3 warhuts and our team drew the line just outside my town. My op firepit was nearby but it was ok because after all, it's so op. Being so op, I was building my 10 op warpriests. I realize those villagers could have been gathering resources like other civs but it feels so good to lame warpriests for my op firepit. A teammate said to protect his cannons at all costs so I made even more op mace to replace the op mace that fought so well earlier. I, of course continued to lame my warpriests but please don't tell my teammates (it'll be our secret).

It was sometime in all this laming and opness that I noticed that I was the only one in the game still in colonial and one of us was in age 4!). My Aztecs have such an op ff I try to hide this too from my teammates and foes so I don't embarrass them too much. I hit my age up button.

The lameness I really love in my op aztecs is the op lame economy. Even though the map has lots of hunts and goldmines, I lame an op plantation and op farm to get mine and hunting improvements. It sets my heart aflutter.

Finally, all this laming tension builds and climaxes when my op Eagles shoot out onto the field of battle (well, it's started as a trickle). Soon, opponents and teammates alike hail my laming op Eagles as just too good.

And that my friends is why I'm an Aztec lamer.

Macabee
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by ZoRPrimE »

You truely have found the Aztec Fountain of Troops! You're quest is now complete Macabee.
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by Tatltael »

mace fail against any real counter

aztec arent OP in any way.. besides eagle runner, amongst maybe a few things.




coyote runner/ mace are weak.. but you can mass mace so thats okay i guess.

pumas are sick nasty

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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by Navarone_Guy »

Mace need to be better against heavy inf and coyotes need a serious resistance boost.

ERK need another nerf to raw attack/boost to multipliers.

Other than that, I see no problem with the civ. :)
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by KingKaramazov »

Wow, my sarcasm detector just EXPLODED.

I was playing in this game, I believe, and you obviously didn't do anything lame, besides mass Eagle Runner Knights once you got to fortress, which didn't have any real effect on the outcome of the game (your team won because Drew had a ton of Great Bombards) and in any case for Aztecs it's really the only decent mid to late game option you have.


There's nothing wrong with playing as the Aztecs, for the most part. The thing is, it's simply a broken civ. Some parts of it suck, other parts are totally lame.

Eagle Runner Knights have no real counter, and even though they have been nerfed a bit they still own most unit types. I'd like to see them changed so they are only effective against the units they are meant to counter (cavalry) and other Aztec units boosted to make up for it (maces and coyote runners).
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by LaZy »

KingKaramazov
Wow, my sarcasm detector just EXPLODED.

I was playing in this game, I believe, and you obviously didn't do anything lame, besides mass Eagle Runner Knights once you got to fortress, which didn't have any real effect on the outcome of the game (your team won because Drew had a ton of Great Bombards)
LLLLLLLooLLLLLLLLLl

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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by I__CHAOS__I »

skirms >>> ERKs in early and mid fortress
lategame, when fully upgraded, it's another story

personally, maces are one of my fav unit. They pwn hard if used properly.
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by 36drew »

Aztec is the most broken civ in the game. Nothing is lame about them (except canoe rush). Anyone who declares otherwise is silly silly IMO.

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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by Sporting_Lisbon »

Tlalocs is obviously broken and lame. Even if you rush him the game goes for like 20 mins because of the OP canoes that kill everything. ERKs are a bit too nasty with ruthlessness don't you think? Nothing else is lame I think ^^ Overall the civ is not lame.

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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by Navarone_Guy »

Actually, I'd like to say Ports are broken as hell too.

Without water they suck. One of the worst civs in the game.

With water they instantly win. I played a major yesterday (After the game we started arguing and he ended up calling me a ****** despite that I'm white) who was Ports, twice, in QS. Both times we got water maps (go figure), and there was nothing I could do. I completely outplayed him, killed him 10 to 1, raided, bombed the crap out of his TCs, but his OP water economy murdered me!! I tried making ships, but he had like 3 frigates. You can't rush cause he turtles with 2 TCs, you can't NOT rush cause he'll spam units at you faster than you can kill em! The guy had horrible micro, too, but micro doesn't matter when you have 40 muskets and 40 bestieros in your base after killing off 300 of them. It was ridiculous.
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by Sporting_Lisbon »

Lol Port auto win on water is new to me. As India yes, you're screwed I completely agree. Hard time as china? :O

Anyway, I know that guy he's portuguese :p He has played ports for a long time, his micro may suck but don't underrate him so easily XD

Being good on water doesn't exactly mean broken. The thing is they suck on land. Almost all civs are broken following that line of thinking :\

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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by StrokeyBlofeld »

Was this the game where we stupidly let Drew take the whole trade route?

(doh).

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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by MizzKid92 »

Mac's OP aztecs just saved my butt. A china lamer and another aztec rushed hard and took out my TC and got me down to 6 vils. But Mac's OP aztecs were able to OP all up on those lame chinese while I manor boomed back to life. Geez, go Mac!
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by KingKaramazov »

[quote=""I__CHAOS__I""]skirms >>> ERKs in early and mid fortress
lategame, when fully upgraded, it's another story

personally, maces are one of my fav unit. They pwn hard if used properly.[/quote]

This isn't really true, especially considering that skirms don't have a bonus against Eagle Warriors as they should. Eagle Warriors are classified as Light Infantry so the only units that have bonuses against them are hand infantry units, which get owned by Eagle Warriors because of their speed, range, and piercing damage.

Cannons are the only unit I can think of that effectively kills Eagles, but of course it's near impossible to hit a large group of Eagle Warriors with cannons...plus Arrow Knights or Coyotes will just kill them quickly in any case.

Add Ruthlessness to the equation and Eagle Warriors are not only very difficult to combat but also are the best villager killers in the game besides Oprichniks (and that may be debatable).

Eagle Warriors don't make the Aztecs OP or unbeatable by any means. They are just a very obnoxious unit that breaks the counter system, and that's why I hate to play against them.
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Re: The OP Aztecs and how to lame them

Post by Cyclohexane »

[quote=""KingKaramazov""][quote=""I__CHAOS__I""]skirms >>> ERKs in early and mid fortress
lategame, when fully upgraded, it's another story

personally, maces are one of my fav unit. They pwn hard if used properly.[/quote]

This isn't really true, especially considering that skirms don't have a bonus against Eagle Warriors as they should. Eagle Warriors are classified as Light Infantry so the only units that have bonuses against them are hand infantry units, which get owned by Eagle Warriors because of their speed, range, and piercing damage.

Cannons are the only unit I can think of that effectively kills Eagles, but of course it's near impossible to hit a large group of Eagle Warriors with cannons...plus Arrow Knights or Coyotes will just kill them quickly in any case.

Add Ruthlessness to the equation and Eagle Warriors are not only very difficult to combat but also are the best villager killers in the game besides Oprichniks (and that may be debatable).

Eagle Warriors don't make the Aztecs OP or unbeatable by any means. They are just a very obnoxious unit that breaks the counter system, and that's why I hate to play against them.[/quote]

All light infantry gets a special line item versus eagle runner knights in the proto file. For example, here is a Skirmisher:

<DamageBonus type 'AbstractHeavyInfantry'>2.000000</DamageBonus>
<DamageBonus type ='AbstractLightCavalry'>1.500000</DamageBonus>
<DamageBonus type ='xpEagleKnight'>1.500000</DamageBonus>

It does not how up in the in-game UI, but the bonus exists. In the next patch, it will even be greater (x2) than versus other ranged cavalry (x1.5). This is because of the way they are defined in the proto file. As it is now, all light infantry (ranged like skirms) get a bonus of 1.5 to dragoons, eagles, bow riders, etc.

In the next patch, light infantry (skirms) will get a x2 bonus to light cavalry & eagle knights but a 0.75 multiplier versus cavalry. Since light cavalry is also cavalry, the bonus light infantry gets to Dragoon type units is x2 x 0.75 = 1.5 (the same as previous patches). However, eagle runner knights are not cavalry so the bonus against them will be x2.

In the next patch, when all cavalry is indirectly boosted, the Aztecs will need to depend on eagle runner knights even more, but they are severely weakened (less range, weaker fire pit, and countered by counters harder than any other civ). Combine that with the fact that Jaguars lost their bonus to cavalry (went from x3 to x2) and pumas do not have any upgrade cards (well, 1 to speed), Aztecs may have some trouble late game against cavalry. Melee units just do not do as well as ranged cavalry versus melee cavalry.

It will definitely be a different game for Aztec players. If you have played Aztecs for any significant amount of time, you would agree that skirms counter eagles just fine until the Aztec player sends 3 – 5 cards, and has 35 dancers on the fire pit not collecting resources (i.e. early to mid fortress). In a 1v1, if the Aztec player gets to this point, he deserves to win. Eagle massing is really only a problem in team games. It is impossible to pull this off against an equally skilled opponent in a 1v1.
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