Who's the best vs Japan

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ruminator
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Who's the best vs Japan

Post by ruminator »

I seem to get about 50% of all games on QS against Japs at present. Is there any one nation that stands a better chance than another against Japs and what is the strat?

I have had some luck with Iroquois recently, constantly raiding with Aenna and Kanya - but it takes a real long time to beat them down and you need to keep pinning them back to ensure they build shrines in their base and so restrict their resources.

There must be an easier way. I haven't played India against them yet, do they match up well?
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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by EndlessPower »

I dont know about India even tho I'm pretty sure that they match up well against anything being imho OP CIV #1.

But speaking for myself, I don't find the Jap vs Aztec matchup too hard, at least not my main prob. (My main prob is as most of u prolly already know $#%"##"%&! $"#%#%& russia)

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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Blackadderthe4th »

Well as Russia i have never had a problem vs Japan. I think any civ with a fast aggressive rush does well here and killing his explorers as soon as possible really hinders a shrine boom.

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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by ruminator »

So, aztecs with the 10 mace/9 mace shipments and Russians with the 13 strelet card seem the best defence against ashigaru. Any other thoughts?
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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Sporting_Lisbon »

India/Aztec. On low level russia too, but there are no really ''tough civs to face'' for japan.

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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Tatltael »

i like sioux :D usually you can give the japs a real run for their money with a semi ff or by sending 7 clubs as 2nd card and spamming cetan / warclub to force ashi /yumi into a melee

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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Navarone_Guy »

China I've found is reasonably effective. Old han qiang in cover mode + CKN is at least moderately effectively at beating an ashi spam. Just send 7 steppe and make discs to take care of any yumi he may have.
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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Soccerman771 »

I agree with adder on Russia being effective, but it gets old. I stopped doing QS b/c more than 50% is Japan, easily. I haven't had good luck with India versus them, but I hear that 10/10 is effective if you don't screw it up like I did...
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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Sporting_Lisbon »

You shouldn't do 10/10 24/7, I don't even know if it's good vs Japan, perhaps normal age up would do better.
China I've found is reasonably effective. Old han qiang in cover mode + CKN is at least moderately effectively at beating an ashi spam. Just send 7 steppe and make discs to take care of any yumi he may have.
I've found that a decent shrine booming with consulate's yamabushi/ashi is too hard too beat. It might work, but it just takes too much it's ridiculous.

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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Navarone_Guy »

Well, you just need to get in there, trash his barracks, and take down his TC and cripple him before he has a chance to get going. If you do that you stand a good chance of winning.
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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Soccerman771 »

[quote=""Sporting_Lisbon""]You shouldn't do 10/10 24/7, I don't even know if it's good vs Japan, perhaps normal age up would do better.
China I've found is reasonably effective. Old han qiang in cover mode + CKN is at least moderately effectively at beating an ashi spam. Just send 7 steppe and make discs to take care of any yumi he may have.
I've found that a decent shrine booming with consulate's yamabushi/ashi is too hard too beat. It might work, but it just takes too much it's ridiculous.[/quote]

I agree you shouldn't 10/10 24/7, however if a Japanese player gets off his feet, you lose (as I'm sure you know). The point of the 10/10 is to keep him in his base and non-productive.
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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by 36drew »

I just don't play japan anymore. Works well enough.

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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Kaiser_von_Nuben »

The bottom line is to make sure he doesn't get that cursed shrine econ going, which is easier said than done. I have had moderate success stopping Japan with Russia, but it is risky. If he masses early nagis and clubs, it's curtains. Personally I like sending 13 strels, training 10 and immediately shooting some cherry-pickers. Then my 5 + 4 cossacks come in to keep up the pressure. If I get lucky, I will keep his vils indoors for long enough to get my own econ going and build a good strel/cossack army. Ashis, of course, are always a problem (ESO needs to do some homework on them imo); there have been times where they beat strels, which is not supposed to happen. But with insane upgrades, consulate AND a wonder, what is a poor 72HP strelet to do against an ashi dealing out 39 damage in colonial? Plus massed ashis take away Russia's cav advantage in a hurry.

Don't get me started on Japan v. Germany. I can count on my fingers how many times I've won this matchup; it ain't pretty 8O . Ashis dismantle uhlans almost instantly and they beat xbows unnervingly fast--which also is not supposed to happen. My only success comes with a semi-FF, then bring the veteran uhlans and skirms on him.

I haven't played many other civs against Japan in 1v1, but I will say that you should NEVER use muskets against Japan with the Brits. Ashis beat them man for man. The only way to go is LB/pike with manor boom.
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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Sporting_Lisbon »

Well, you just need to get in there, trash his barracks, and take down his TC and cripple him before he has a chance to get going.
Yep, that's exactly what I'm referring too. How exactly do you beat 5 shipped Ashis + 5 built Ashis + TC fire + irregulars + monks + consulate clubmen? Ashi/clubmen combo is so nasty vs China...

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Re: Who's the best vs Japan

Post by Navarone_Guy »

All you need is godly micro, CKN, and a bunch of qiang and a monk all in cover mode. :)
Groovy.

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