My thoughts on the patch so far.

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Soccerman771
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Soccerman771 »

[quote=""KingKaramazov""][quote=""I__CHAOS__I""][quote=""Soccerman771""]though I don't like the sevast nerf thinking it should have been maybe a nerf to .65 or .7 since it should at least beat the normal fast-build card to make it advantageous to play sevastapol over the other card..[/quote]

sevastopol is still better than Stonemasons.
they are different is what they affect[/quote]

Yea, big difference between build speed and build points.

From the patch notes posted on AgeSanc I thought they might have changed it to build speed, in which case it would be useless. Thankfully that's not the case, although I doubt I'll be using it much anymore when I play Russia. I didn't even use it that much before.[/quote]

From the Patch Notes:
RUSSIANS

Strelet

Train points decreased to 30.00 (down from 32.00).
Musketeer

Train points decreased to 23.00 (down from 27.00).
Card – Sevastapol

Effect decreased to 50% bonus to building speed (down from 85% bonus).
The building speed was decreased...
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Sporting_Lisbon »

I still feel Aennas are crap, dont get to out range musket units like Ashis, as by the time they get to fire, the ashi's were in range for them to fire, the animation for Aennas means it taks them ages to fire, its not even like the Lbow where the ROF seems to decrease, they are just coninuously slow, still useless imo.
Wrong, aennas don't shoot as fast as lbs but they have 2x multiplier and they have a 2.1 ROF. When Iro was OP and I rushed I beat mass skirms with mass aennas.

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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by RascalJones »

[quote=""Soccerman771""][quote=""KingKaramazov""][quote=""I__CHAOS__I""][quote=""Soccerman771""]though I don't like the sevast nerf thinking it should have been maybe a nerf to .65 or .7 since it should at least beat the normal fast-build card to make it advantageous to play sevastapol over the other card..[/quote]

sevastopol is still better than Stonemasons.
they are different is what they affect[/quote]

Yea, big difference between build speed and build points.

From the patch notes posted on AgeSanc I thought they might have changed it to build speed, in which case it would be useless. Thankfully that's not the case, although I doubt I'll be using it much anymore when I play Russia. I didn't even use it that much before.[/quote]

From the Patch Notes:
RUSSIANS

Strelet

Train points decreased to 30.00 (down from 32.00).
Musketeer

Train points decreased to 23.00 (down from 27.00).
Card – Sevastapol

Effect decreased to 50% bonus to building speed (down from 85% bonus).
The building speed was decreased...[/quote]

I don't have the link, but I read from someone at ES that it was to build points and not building speed.

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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Puddleglum »

Soccerman,
The problem is that the cards are not 100% clear about what they do. Every building has a number of build points. For example, a fort has 150. In a medium game, 1 villiager completes one build point in 1 second. This means 1 villager builds 1 fort in 150 seconds.

Now, my understanding is that Sevastopol decreases the number of build points a building requires, whereas Stonemasons increases the rate at which villagers complete build points. So it goes like this:

Stonemasons:
Villager build rate increased from 1 BP/sec to 1.65 BP/sec
1.65 BP/Sec * 150 BP = 90 seconds to build a fort with 1 Villager

Sevastopol:
-50% Build points gives Fort 75 Build Points
1 BP/Sec => 75 seconds to build a for with 1 villager (Compared to 22.5 seconds before the nerf)
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Sporting_Lisbon »

Now the card makes them build twice as fast instead of 100%/15%=6,67 times faster. That's quite a nerf.

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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Puddleglum »

[quote=""Sporting_Lisbon""]Now the card makes them build twice as fast instead of 100%/15%=6,67 times faster. That's quite a nerf.[/quote]

Yeah, it was basically nerfed by a factor of 3, which is incredible. It's still mildly better than Stonemasons, but I doubt if it will see much use anymore. It's hard to believe that the card was really 3X OP before.
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Soccerman771 »

Thanks puddleglum and sporting. That really clears it up. All I know last night is I played the card and it was like waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay slow. I'm gonna replace it in all my decks with a military shipment. I never really used the card before unless it was like my 6th or 7th card and I needed to wall up.
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by djdan »

[quote=""Sporting_Lisbon""]
I still feel Aennas are crap, dont get to out range musket units like Ashis, as by the time they get to fire, the ashi's were in range for them to fire, the animation for Aennas means it taks them ages to fire, its not even like the Lbow where the ROF seems to decrease, they are just coninuously slow, still useless imo.
Wrong, aennas don't shoot as fast as lbs but they have 2x multiplier and they have a 2.1 ROF. When Iro was OP and I rushed I beat mass skirms with mass aennas.[/quote]

Lol dunno what I was on when I typed this but I meant Lbows shoot faster than Aennas, but i mean the ROF of Lbows increase after the first shot so they fire faster, whereas the Aenna continuously shoot at a crap rate
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Soccerman771 »

Ok, my thoughts on patch. Russia is different. I played an unrated against Germany at same level and I was pretty much forced go musk/strelet combo to fight off the uhlans&pikes (nothing new there). But the 4+5 cossack shipments...are fricken awesome. Forces him to make pikes/x-bows instead of going fortress. You can keep a lot more pressure on in colonial. The 9 halbs shipment in fortress is a must and probably even better than 2 falcs.

Played one china game and aged up with the summer palace instead of the tower to go to colonial. The 400 food really helps. China takes much more resource management imo.. disc's are still 80 food (thought they were supposed to be 100), and they still convert/multiply..
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by KingKaramazov »

yea, based on that information, I'd say Seva was really nerfed way too hard, basically into oblivion.

There's no way anybody will use it anymore, which is a shame. Even though it was lame before, there wasn't any need to nerf it to the point of practical uselessness.

Ah well.

Russia definitely looks more interesting in this patch. With the Seva nerf, a faster start, and faster building infantry, seems like they can (and must) go back to being an aggressive civ again.
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Comadevil »

[quote=""Soccerman771""] Forces him to make pikes/x-bows instead of going fortress. You can keep a lot more pressure on in colonial. [/quote]

This is what the patch intended. Also u need now pikes in the back to guard ur villies against cav else u can be sure u will lose them fast to raiding cav. i think u will see this now very often

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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Soccerman771 »

[quote=""Comadevil""][quote=""Soccerman771""] Forces him to make pikes/x-bows instead of going fortress. You can keep a lot more pressure on in colonial. [/quote]

This is what the patch intended. Also u need now pikes in the back to guard ur villies against cav else u can be sure u will lose them fast to raiding cav. i think u will see this now very often[/quote]

Yeah, he had pikes just sitting there guarding his villies..all idle. Problem w/Russia is, well they have no pikes..but they do have halbs in Age III. I'm honestly thinking Russia may be a genuine Semi-ff civ now...
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by KingKaramazov »

Eh. I'm really skeptical about the worth of Russian Halbs. The changes in the patch shouldn't have made them much more useful than they were before - and they weren't really useful at all before.

Once you're fortress, Cav Archers are far better as anti-cav than watered-down, slow Russian Halbs.
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by Soccerman771 »

I've never really gotten into the cav archers. It would probably help my game to start using more of them...
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Re: My thoughts on the patch so far.

Post by KingKaramazov »

They're the best form of anti-cav that Russia has. Not saying much, but they are fairly useful.
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