Final fix for Thouroughbreds Card and Cuirassiers

[murdilator]

First, before I post anything here, I would like to ask: are Cuirassiers still too good on FP? I remember that they were slightly nerfed and that they no longer train instantly. If so, not everything in this post pertains as much in urgency.


See Title.



I have thought of a perfect fix for the Cuirassier. These units are beatable, but are hard to kill and make life hectic ingame. Although Throuroughbreds has been changed already once,it needs one final go to make it fair and still decent.



Thouroughbreds



Description: Decreases Cuirassier cost and train time.

Current Effects:

-15% Food Cost

-15% Coin Cost

-15% Train Points



New Card:

Thouroughbreds



Description: Decreases Cuirassier cost and increases speed, but due to higher quality horses they take more time to train.

Effects:

-10% Food Cost (135 Food)

-10% Coin cost (135 coin)

+10% Cuirassier Speed (increases to 6.875)

+15% Train Points (On RE this is +9.0 seconds to train time; lategame in RE it will take 15 seconds to train Cuirs instead of Instant. On FP It will probably take 24 seconds to train fully upgraded)



Also, for Cuirassiers:

- Built Limit set to 32.

- Imperial Gendarme upgrade now costs 2 Homecity shipments in addition to 1500 wood and 1500 coin.



This should fix Cuirassiers to be a powerful cavalry, but a French player will sacrifice quite a bit in a Long NR game to get them fully upgraded. Also, when people tribute resources to France in Supremacy, the French player, when getting to Imperial, won't be able to spam out insane Cuirs right away, giving other players a chance.



What do you all say to this? Does this sound good?




regards,




murdilator

[wicked_assassin]

I think the main problem of cruir is their strenght. If the creation speed is slower you build more stabels (if you have no cards, you build a lot of stabels)

[36drew]

Providing a rationale for the above changes would be a good idea. The problem with cur's is their area damage. Patching this is a lot more difficult than you can imagine. The rest of the unit is fine really.

Increasing speed on a unit with the heavy cav tag doesn't make sense either. Especially since curs can (in many situations) already beat one of their counters (range cav). Increasing speed would only worsen this problem.

Trying to balance for NR games and team games is quite difficult, nearly impossible in fact.

[Zutazuta]

The real problem with Cuirs is actually not the unit itself. When its just a few plain Cuirs, they are perfectly balanced (on FP), but when you get them in large numbers, the area effect of their attack really comes into play like Drew said. Having said that, I don't think that's even the largest problem. The biggest problem with late game cuirs is all the upgrades they have, just like Ashi in ES 1.01a (to a lesser extent).

[murdilator]

Maybe a cap limit of 25 Cuirs would suffice then. Or another solution is to make the cav cards give cuirs -5% stats, so +15%, then -5% for just 10%. In Vanilla they are quite beatable; they don't have as good military improvements and the French don't have as good economy from cards. If we nerf all the gathering rate cards to their Vanilla status, we should be good. I honestly think that making Refrigeration 15%, Royal Mint 20%, Textile Mills 20%, etc. would help civs that don't get these cards (i.e. India partially, Iroquois, Sioux, Aztec?, Ottoman partially).

[wicked_assassin]

Melee horses in general are a lot stronger in tad then in vanilla.